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Sun, 10th Sep. 2006, 22:50
Synthehol is here
Scientists have created a drug that mimics the 'good' effects of alchohol without the hangoverInteresting bit of research (found via OmniBrain), but the bit I find really interesting is the ethical reponses to this, and the discussion of how such a drug would be legislated - it's liable to be much more strictly controlled than alchohol, although it doesn't have such catastrophic health effects (at least as far as they know yet :)), which does really hilight how something like alchohol really does get away with a lot compared to drugs with similar (or in this case identical) effects, legislationwise. The prospect of being able to instantly sober up does seem attractive, as does the exactitude of dosage, meaning you could aim for an appropriate level of inebriation accurately. Of course the downside would be that all of the social troubles with drunkeness are still there, plus no clue as to whether the long term effects give you cancer or something of the sort. So, if it was legal, would you take it? If you were a non-drinker would you take it? If you didn't 'do drugs' would you take it? :) Sun, 10th Sep. 2006 22:03 (UTC)
![[info]](http://l-stat.livejournal.com/img/userinfo.gif) siani_hedgehog
i'd take it. once. but then i'd be snooty and say that they were missing the joy of savouring a good whiskey/beer/whatever. and just go back to drinking. Sun, 10th Sep. 2006 22:06 (UTC)
kissycat1000
People who don't drink alcohol usually avoid it because they don't like the loss of control etc that goes with being drunk. Therefore it's unlikely that most would take a drug that has exactly that effect. People who do drink alcohol usually do it because they like the taste of alcohol, therefore it's unlikely that most would take a drug that isn't as enjoyable to consume. This would put the people who wanted the drug rather than the alcohol in the minority, as far as I can see. Sun, 10th Sep. 2006 22:48 (UTC)
dystopatica
"People who don't drink alcohol usually avoid it because they don't like the loss of control etc that goes with being drunk. Therefore it's unlikely that most would take a drug that has exactly that effect." Precisely, and this is exactly why I wouldn't take this, in fact it's removing the only positive benefit alcohol has in my eyes, and that's some of it actually tastes nice. The being drunk part is the downside in my opinion. Sun, 10th Sep. 2006 22:55 (UTC)
samoth
See, as a *very* moderate and infrequent drinker, I think there is a point *before* being drunk, where it's just a very mild disinhibitor, and makes people a bit more relaxed and sociable. This is long before the loss of control of 'proper' drunkenness. It's the only bit of being 'drunk' I actually enjoy. However, I find I can get the same effect by being in good company, which generally does the trick. It's quite hard to judge this dosage with alcohol though. However, I think that a lot of people do drink for this mild disinhibition, as well as for the more extreme kinds of drunkeness - depends on the people. I'm really not convinced that many people *start* drinking for the flavour, although I think they learn to like it. Sun, 10th Sep. 2006 22:51 (UTC)
samoth
People who do drink alcohol usually do it because they like the taste of alcohol, therefore it's unlikely that most would take a drug that isn't as enjoyable to consume.I'd question this actually, since most alchohol tastes pretty horrid on your very first tries of it, hence the popularity of alcopops which try and mask the flavour. It's very much an aquired taste. I'm not sure people try and aquire it because they just like the flavour, or in theory the range of non-alcoholic beers would be much larger and more popular (yeah, I know they're mostly repellent, but my point still stands) Mon, 11th Sep. 2006 08:30 (UTC)
burritob
I'd similarly reject the notion that most non-drinkers are motivated by a lack of control (& etc) while drunk. My younger brother doesn't drink. Never has. As a kid, he wouldn't even eat cakes that contained booze. He's never been under the influence, he simply abhors the taste/smell of the stuff. Similarly, most friends who now teetotal (or have significantly cut down their intake) do so because of the impact on the health and well-being after they stopped drinking (savage hangovers, and the like). Granted, I also know a few people who stopped drinking because of drunken shenanigans and/or memory loss, but they're firmly in the minority (in this humble reporter's anecdotal evidence, at least). Sun, 10th Sep. 2006 22:22 (UTC)
leopardspice
I don't particularly like alcohol, so probably no more than I already drink. I can't see the government letting it out. They've already stopped the production of several "herbal highs" for little reason other than that they work too well. Sun, 10th Sep. 2006 22:38 (UTC)
kynetik
I don't think I would take it to substitute alcahol... I don't drink. I might take it as a replacement drug though. Maybe. *shrugs* There are good effects of alcahol? ;) Mon, 11th Sep. 2006 00:02 (UTC)
squink
count me in ;D Mon, 11th Sep. 2006 00:43 (UTC)
oholiab
With any luck, the direct result of this will be that alcohol is cheaper. I for one REALLY enjoy the actual experience of drinking, and not just the after effects. I absolutely love beer, and the feeling I get after drinking a FEW pints. No more though. I wouldn't take such a drug, as I perhaps enjoy the idea that I am responsible enough to enjoy drinking without getting too drunk. Mon, 11th Sep. 2006 00:53 (UTC)
dangermonkey
So, is it injectable or pill/powder format? (: Mon, 11th Sep. 2006 07:57 (UTC)
samoth
If I tell you you need to inject it into your eyeball, you'll probably like it more, won't you? :) Mon, 11th Sep. 2006 08:26 (UTC)
dangermonkey
No way! I have a thing about eye balls!
but otherwise, yeah, most likely (:
Mon, 11th Sep. 2006 09:51 (UTC)
samoth
Ok, suppository then? :) Mon, 11th Sep. 2006 17:05 (UTC)
dangermonkey
"Err, not right now Ed, we've got work to do!"
Mon, 11th Sep. 2006 06:12 (UTC)
poggs
No. What's the point of going to a pub, ordering dinner, popping a pill, then saying "Oh, time to go", popping another one and then go home? Drinking is a social thing. Mon, 11th Sep. 2006 08:01 (UTC)
samoth
Surely socialising is a social thing, the actual *drinking* bit of it isn't important per-se? I manage to go out to the pub and have a nice time socialising with my friends without drinking - it's the friends that are important, not the drink? The drinking acts as a social lubricant, by making people more relaxed and talkative, but then in theory, so does this drug, so what's the difference? I do think it's very interesting the way it makes people think and talk about reason about their use of alcohol... Mon, 11th Sep. 2006 08:41 (UTC)
fire_brand
But...why are you going to a pub if you aren't drinking? I think the only way forward would be to make this drug into a drink, if possible. Otherwise where are our pubs going to go? Where will we go to consume this drug? Will there be a monopoly on it? What will happen to alcohol licensing? What about age limits? Blah blah blah... although most of those questions stand anyway. Mon, 11th Sep. 2006 08:42 (UTC)
fire_brand
Let me clarify this - why would you go to a pub with a group of friends if none of you intend on drinking. Lol, didn't mean to make that sound so accusatory... Mon, 11th Sep. 2006 09:38 (UTC)
siani_hedgehog
because big chunks of the country are woefully bereft of coffee shops where you can sit sipping coffee all night? Mon, 11th Sep. 2006 09:45 (UTC)
dennyd
Good point. Coffee shops with pool tables are clearly the way forward. Mon, 11th Sep. 2006 09:44 (UTC)
dennyd
To play pool and get something to eat that doesn't cost a fortune - that's the only reason I go to pubs anyway. Well, that and to see the other people who are there. Mon, 11th Sep. 2006 09:48 (UTC)
samoth
Let me clarify this - why would you go to a pub with a group of friends if none of you intend on drinking.Because they're one of the few acceptable, late night, social gathering places. If there were other good ones, then I'd happily go to those instead. Note that in theory, you'd be going there to have this alcohol replacement stuff instead :) Lol, didn't mean to make that sound so accusatory...I'm sure we can punish you for your tone of voice later... Mon, 11th Sep. 2006 09:50 (UTC)
samoth
I think the only way forward would be to make this drug into a drink, if possible. Otherwise where are our pubs going to go?Hence my calling it 'synthehol' in the title. I suspect if they do make this, it'll go in something like an alcopop. You could then keep your entire existing infrastructure. Except that in theory you'd be able to drink the antidote and then drive home :) Mon, 11th Sep. 2006 12:35 (UTC)
fire_brand
There is a problem with monopoly though - would one company be producing a few difference flavours of one drink? I'm not exactly sure what kind of effect it would have on the market - but it would certainly effect pub pricing. No variety in product means no variety in prices and where people come in spending varying amounts on drinks as it is, they may lose revenue if everything is priced as an alcopop. Of course if it was a monopoly, the drinks may well be horribly overpriced. Also, all of our existing brewery's who run the majority of our existing pubs would most probably not survive or have to massively scale down should this become popular. If people catch on that this equals drink -hangover then there will be little need for these older products. Not that I think its a bad idea at all. Just saying, could have quiet a widescale effect. On the other hand it could divebomb completely if not handled correctly. This unorganised brain splurge has been bought to you by Packing Up All My Shit in partnership with Lily and A Chesty Cough. Mon, 11th Sep. 2006 09:36 (UTC)
siani_hedgehog
Surely socialising is a social thing, the actual *drinking* bit of it isn't important per-se?well, drinking really makes me sympathise with smokers. i'm a fidgety person - having a pint gives me something to do with my hands, and offers me an excuse to occupy my mouth with something other than talk. there's also the social lubricant thing - i may feel that i can take a risk i otherwise wouldn't, and the pill would fill that up... but so would a million other excuses. when i'm socialising without drinking, i generally have endless cups of coffee. so i think that the *act* of drinking is probably as appealing as the effects. Mon, 11th Sep. 2006 17:22 (UTC)
samoth
when i'm socialising without drinking, i generally have endless cups of coffee. so i think that the *act* of drinking is probably as appealing as the effects.So add the drug to the coffee. Alcoholic coffee isn't exactly a new idea :) This would just have less drawbacks in theory :) Tue, 12th Sep. 2006 11:54 (UTC)
siani_hedgehog
in that case, i'm 100% there. i never had a hangover until i was about 23, and i'd love to have my youthful liver back. Mon, 11th Sep. 2006 06:41 (UTC)
_leet_
What happens if you mix it with alcohol? \o/ Mon, 11th Sep. 2006 08:02 (UTC)
samoth
You get Super-Mega-Ultra-Drunk(tm), obviously. :) Mon, 11th Sep. 2006 10:39 (UTC)
deathboy
bahahahahhahhaahhaah :D I'm friending you. Any mind that thinks like that deserves respect. :) Mon, 11th Sep. 2006 17:20 (UTC)
samoth
I suspect you two would get on anyhow :) Tue, 12th Sep. 2006 06:54 (UTC)
_leet_
Wooooo! Wait, does that mean I have to post something now?! PWN'D!!! I'm friending you back now... so you too shall post, which you probably do, so that's ummmm not really a massive threat. Mon, 11th Sep. 2006 10:38 (UTC)
deathboy
absolutely. if I could kill the hangovers and not destroy my innards, this would be winlicious. Mon, 11th Sep. 2006 17:49 (UTC)
azekeil
Here's another take, from the school of "oi don't trust them fernikety drugs": Humans have been brewing/distilling and drinking alcoholic drinks for millenia. Okay, short in terms of evolution, but in terms of culture it's kind of there. I can see some might find it useful; I'd probably wait until more information on the drug was available before considering trying it, on the basis that I've already accepted to take alcohol into my system and suffer the side-effects/consequences of that, but there may be other unknown side-effects/consequences of the 'synthehol'. Other than that I can see everyone's point here.. Mon, 11th Sep. 2006 21:53 (UTC)
samoth
Well no, I'm not making any claim that it's *safe*, or that there might not be (worse?) side-effects than 'real' alcohol in the long run. But people's attitude, and legislation isn't anything to do with 'humans have been doing it for millenia'. If that were the case, naturally occuring halucinogens (say) which have been used ritually by humans for millenia, would be just fine too. Except they're not :) It's the funny status of alcohol as 'not a drug' which fascinates me. The way the possibility of this 'drug' as an alternative form of it, and the way people respond to that I find very interesting. Sun, 24th Sep. 2006 22:17 (UTC)
lieutenanth
Hello, I'm Kendrick, we met on Wednesday! I discovered your journal at random while surfing but thought I'd say hi :) We should instantly replace all alcohol in the UK with this stuff and issue spray cans of the 'antidote' to bouncers, SWFs, and, well, anyone who wants one. Someone being aggressively drunk? No problem. Spppspsssssss. Voila! Sober as a stone! Mon, 25th Sep. 2006 15:01 (UTC)
samoth
Hey Kendrick! Good stalking skills :) Have added you back. I like the idea of spray cans for bouncers. Although imagine the embarrassment you could cause with one of those - people suddenly realising what table they were dancing half-naked on, or which of their office colleagues they were snogging :) Wed, 27th Sep. 2006 11:30 (UTC)
lieutenanth
You're only selling me further on this idea!!! |
